5-HTP

I had chemotherapy and have not been able to get off sugar since. How long will it take 5-HTP or tryptophan to stop the cravings?

July 26, 2024 By Trudy Scott 4 Comments

Lauren shared her struggle with sugar cravings that started after chemotherapy, asking her question on a recent tryptophan/DPA cravings blog post:

If I try the tryptophan or the 5-HTP and one or the other works, how long will I need to take them for the sugar cravings to stop?

Back in 2021 I had been off sugar for 2 years and it was easy to get off by slowing eliminating sugar. The last elimination was from my coffee and then it was easy to stay away from sugar.

I had chemotherapy for 6 months in 2022. I have not been able to get off sugar since then. After chemo ended, I had the cravings and don’t know how to end the cravings.

Any advice from you would be appreciated.

The good news is that if you have cravings that are caused by low serotonin and you find your ideal dose of tryptophan or 5-HTP, you will notice reduced sugar cravings immediately and they will be further reduced with consistent use, typically a few times a day.

The key is to figure out if your cravings are caused by low serotonin and then it’s a matter of doing a trial of either tryptophan or 5-HTP (if you get results and other low serotonin symptoms improve it’s a clue you’re on track). And then you need to figure out the ideal dose for your unique needs. I share more about all this below and additional information about other types of cravings caused by neurotransmitter imbalances (and the respective amino acids that help).

Since her cravings struggles started after chemotherapy I also discuss possible impacts on neurotransmitters and also candida (sugar cravings are very common with the candida). Read on for my response to the above question from Lauren.

Sugar cravings caused by low serotonin: tryptophan or 5-HTP may offer immediate results

As I mentioned above you will notice reduced sugar cravings immediately with either tryptophan or 5-HTP if your cravings are caused by low serotonin. A big clue with low serotonin-type sugar or carb cravings is that they are more intense in the late afternoon and evening.

A good place to start (as always) is with the symptoms questionnaire. If there are other low serotonin symptoms such as feeling more anxious, worried, fearful with a low mood and irritability etc, that further confirms it’s worth doing a trial.

Some folks do better with one than the other but I have clients start with tryptophan and then switch to 5-HTP if their results are not as expected. In both instances we open the capsule or use powders or a chewable to get instant feedback on the benefits. So in that first session Lauren should be able to say “wow my cravings have reduced from 10/10 to 5/10” within 5-10 minutes. She may also report she feels more optimistic and less worried.

It is possible that her cravings are not caused by low serotonin or that they are a combination of a number of factors.

Sugar cravings caused by other neurotransmitter imbalances, and other amino acids to the rescue

We also look at sugar cravings caused by low GABA (stress eating because of physical tension), low endorphins (comfort eating or emotional eating), low dopamine (eating for an energy boost or improved focus) and low blood sugar (eating due to crankiness and irritability).

Lauren would know if any of the above may be factors based on her scores on the symptoms questionnaire i.e. scores for cravings and other symptoms. This offers further clarification:

If you eat sugar or carbs to feel happy (and especially from late afternoon into the evening) then your sugar cravings are likely due to low serotonin, and tryptophan (or 5-HTP) stops the cravings and boosts mood and reduces anxiety
If you stress-eat your sugar cravings are likely due to low GABA, and GABA will stop the stress-eating and calm you down
If you are a comfort-eater then it’s likely due to low endorphins and DPA will stop that feeling of “I deserve-it” kind of reward-eating or comfort-eating and also give you a hug-like mood boost
If you eat sugar for an energy boost or to give your focus then it’s likely due to low catecholamines and tyrosine will stop those cravings and give you a mood and energy boost, and help with mental clarity
If you have to eat sugar when you haven’t eaten in awhile it’s likely low blood sugar and glutamine on the tongue stops the sugar desire almost immediately and also helps with the low blood sugar symptoms of shakiness and irritability

As you can see there is an amino acid for each of these imbalances and it’s a matter of doing a similar trial for each one. With the correct dose, Lauren can expect quick results too, provided she finds the ideal dose for her needs.

This is the blog post Lauren posted her question on: Tryptophan and DPA (d-phenylalanine) for cravings and sleep issues (and a concern about 5-HTP and nightmares).

It’s one of many posts on the site about amino acids and sugar cravings so I encourage you to use the search feature of the blog.

Chemotherapy: impacts on serotonin and dopamine

Because chemotherapy has an impact on serotonin and dopamine, this may be where Lauren needs to start when considering which amino acids to trial. Here is some additional information on “chemobrain” or chemotherapy-induced cognitive impairment:

… a medical complication of cancer treatment that is characterized by a general decline in cognition affecting visual and verbal memory, attention, complex problem solving skills, and motor function. It is estimated that one-third of patients who undergo chemotherapy treatment will experience cognitive impairment.

Alterations in the release and uptake of dopamine and serotonin, central nervous system neurotransmitters that play important roles in cognition, could potentially contribute to impaired intellectual performance in those impacted by chemobrain.

And this may offer an explanation as to why she hasn’t been able to quit sugar since chemotherapy.

Chemotherapy, candida albicans and sugar cravings

If none of the above approaches reduce her cravings or if they do help to some extent but are not quite enough, we have to keep looking for root causes.

A big clue is that Lauren had been able to quit sugar using willpower in the past but has struggled since chemotherapy. It’s important to consider the role this may be playing. In cancer patients who have gone through chemotherapy there is increased susceptibility to Candida albicans, “a fungal commensal and a major colonizer of the human skin, as well as of the gastrointestinal and genitourinary tracts.” This is reported to be caused primarily by “chemotherapy-induced depression of innate immune cells and weakened epithelial barriers, which are the body’s first-line defenses against fungal infections.”

Sugar cravings are very common with candida and in some cases can be so severe that no amino acids will work until the candida is addressed. Interestingly, in one candida study, short exposure to serotonin resulted in antifungal activity so it’s possible that tryptophan or 5-HTP helps.

I don’t have my candida symptoms questionnaire on the blog but you can find a mini version on page 93 of my book, The Antianxiety Food Solution and additional information and my dietary/nutrient protocol in chapter 5 of my book.

The full candida questionnaire can be found in William G. Crook’s excellent book, The Yeast Connection and Women’s Health (my Amazon link).

Additional resources when you are new to using amino acids as supplements

As always, I use the symptoms questionnaire to figure out if low low serotonin or other neurotransmitter imbalances may be an issue.

If you suspect low levels of any of the neurotransmitters and do not yet have my book, The Antianxiety Food Solution – How the Foods You Eat Can Help You Calm Your Anxious Mind, Improve Your Mood, and End Cravings, I highly recommend getting it and reading it before jumping in and using amino acids on your own so you are knowledgeable. And be sure to share it with the practitioner/health team you or your loved one is working with.

There is an entire chapter on the amino acids and they are discussed throughout the book in the sections on gut health, gluten, blood sugar control (this is covered in an entire chapter too), sugar cravings, anxiety and mood issues.

The book doesn’t include product names (per the publisher’s request) so this blog, The Antianxiety Food Solution Amino Acid and Pyroluria Supplements, lists the amino acids that I use with my individual clients and those in my group programs.

If, after reading this blog and my book, you don’t feel comfortable figuring things out on your own (i.e. doing the symptoms questionnaire and respective amino acids trials), a good place to get help is the GABA QuickStart Program (if you have low GABA symptoms too). This is a paid online/virtual group program where you get my guidance and community support.

If you are a practitioner, join us in The Balancing Neurotransmitters: the Fundamentals program. This is also a paid online/virtual program with an opportunity to interact with me and other practitioners who are also using the amino acids.

Wrapping up and your feedback

I appreciate Lauren for posting her question on the blog so I can share and we all can learn.

Now I’d love to hear from you – does any of this resonate with you? If yes, what approach helped reduce your sugar cravings after chemotherapy?

If you’re a practitioner have you seen these approaches work well with your clients/patients?

Feel free to share and ask your questions below.

Tryptophan and DPA (d-phenylalanine) for cravings and sleep issues (and a concern about 5-HTP and nightmares)

June 21, 2024 By Trudy Scott 19 Comments

Thank you for all your work! I saw your talk in the Super Trauma conference and immediately went and read your book. I suspect I am low in all 3 neurotransmitters, and have noticed the biggest difference in supplementing with DPA (d-phenylalanine). I started taking all 3 supplements by swallowing and switched to taking them sublingually after I got used to the idea.

My question is about tryptophan in particular. I struggle with nightmares already so I am a bit wary of trying 5-HTP. I tried taking mid afternoon and before bed but it made me way too tired in the afternoon. Is it okay to just double the dose right before bed? How safe are these amino acids in higher doses? I was also wanting to add an evening dose of DPA to help with cravings. Thanks again!

I get many questions like this on the blog about using either 5-HTP with DPA or tryptophan with DPA together, for helping to improve sleep and ease sugar cravings. So today I’m sharing one of these questions and my insights in case you have a similar question. This will also give you the opportunity to ask questions you may have related to using these amino acids together and gain an understanding on how to tweak the amino acids for optimal results.

Read on for my response to the above question from Amanda. I also share more about 5-HTP and nightmares (and why she may also decide to use this amino acid too), vitamin B6 and nightmares, pyroluria, and how to figure out if your cravings are due to low endorphins or low serotonin (or a combination).

Should she add an evening dose of DPA?

It’s wonderful to hear that DPA is helping with Amanda’s comfort cravings/emotional eating and other low endorphin symptoms. As a reminder these include:

Heightened sensitivity to emotional pain
Heightened sensitivity to physical pain
Crying or tearing up easily
Eating to soothe your mood, or comfort eating
Really, really loving certain foods, behaviors, drugs, or alcohol
Craving a reward or numbing treat
PMS (premenstrual syndrome) or PMDD (premenstrual dysphoric disorder) *

(bookmark this symptoms questionnaire because it’s updated as new research is published and has more symptoms listed that what is included in my book)

And in case you’re new to DPA (d-phenylalanine), it is an amino acid that prevents the breakdowns of endorphins so we have more of these feel-good neurotransmitters.

I’m really glad she figured out it’s more effective when opened and used on the tongue rather than swallowing it. I share more about this here – How best to use the amino acid DPA for easing heart-ache, weepiness, comfort eating and a compulsive desire for food. It really can mean the difference between no results and great results.

Amanda asks about adding an evening dose of DPA to help with endorphin-related cravings too and also using tryptophan only at night. Keep in mind that afternoon and evening cravings are typically related to low serotonin and it’s best to trial one amino acid at a time so you know which is working for which symptom. If we were working together, I’d recommend figuring out her serotonin support first and then layering in an extra DPA (or possibly two) at night if it’s still needed.

In case you’re curious, I discussed low serotonin, low endorphins and low GABA in my interview at the Trauma Super Conference so she is also using GABA. Using this one sublingually is key and it helps with easing physical tension and stress eating.

What could her serotonin support look like?

Since tryptophan used mid afternoon and before bed made her way too tired in the afternoon she could consider a lower dose of tryptophan (midafternoon and evening) or could just trial one tryptophan after dinner to help with sleep and reduce after dinner cravings.

For some folks this is enough. If not, after a few days of tracking symptoms, she could increase to one tryptophan after dinner and another at bedtime or two tryptophan at bedtime if her symptoms are not down 2/10 or 3/10.

Her concern about 5-HTP and nightmares

Some folks do better on 5-HTP and some on tryptophan and she is getting results with tryptophan so doesn’t really have to worry about 5-HTP at this stage. However, I do want to address Amanda’s concern about 5-HTP and nightmares, because in the future she may want to consider 5-HTP.

She may find she does in fact need some serotonin support earlier in the day and 5-HTP in the afternoon may be the answer for her i.e. 5-HTP midafternoon and tryptophan in the early evening and/or at bedtime. It’s not unusual that we mix and match these two amino acids.

I’ve not had any clients report nightmares with 5-HTP, so I was surprised to hear this feedback on a Facebook thread, where a number of folks stopped using it for this reason. However, most folks on the same Facebook thread shared that 5-HTP works very well for them and does not cause nightmares. There is also research that supports the use of 5-HTP for night terrors. I suspect it may have to do with low vitamin B6 which we know contributes to poor dream recall and/or nightmares.

I share more about 5-HTP and nightmares here. And vitamin B6 and dream recall here.

I posed this question in the 5-HTP/nightmares blog: “Could it be that folks who get nightmares with 5-HTP, happen to also have pyroluria? Or perhaps they simply have low vitamin B6?” I have all my anxious clients supplement with vitamin B6 and/or P5P and this may be why nightmares with 5-HTP was news to me.

Vitamin B6 for neurotransmitter production and pyroluria

Since she does already struggle with nightmares, I’m not surprised she is concerned. However nightmares are a clue that someone may have low vitamin B6. This is typically picked up when I have clients do the pyroluria questionnaire on the intake form. Addressing low vitamin B6 is also important because it’s a cofactor for making the neurotransmitters and helps with hormone balancing.

I reminded her to read the pyroluria chapter in my book too. It includes the above questionnaire and detailed information on vitamin B6, zinc and evening primrose oil (all needed to address this condition that leads to feelings of being socially anxious).

How safe are these amino acids in higher amounts?

I share the top of the range for dosing all the amino acids in my book. This is typically 1500 mg tryptophan twice a day, 150 mg 5-HTP twice a day and 1500 mg DPA three times a day. Occasionally I have had clients need higher doses. The clue is symptom relief. We start low, monitor symptoms and adjust up as needed, and then down if no additional benefits are observed.

Using extra DPA at night for cravings?

As I mentioned above, I’d recommend figuring out serotonin support first (tryptophan only or a combination of 5-HTP and tryptophan) and then layering in an extra DPA (or possibly two) in the evening if it’s still needed for comfort cravings.

For some folks it’s very easy to identify comfort cravings (low endorphins) from worry/low mood cravings (low serotonin):

If you eat sugar or carbs to feel happy (and especially from late afternoon into the evening) then your sugar cravings are likely due to low serotonin, and tryptophan (or 5-HTP) stops the cravings and boosts mood and reduces anxious feelings
If you are a comfort-eater then it’s likely due to low endorphins and DPA will stop that feeling of “I deserve-it” kind of reward-eating or comfort-eating and also give you a hug-like mood boost

If it’s not easy to figure out the only way to know for sure is to do a trial of tryptophan and then do a trial of DPA and observe before and after feelings and the need to self-medicate with whatever the sugary treat is. Amanda may need one or the other at various times and she may even need both at certain times.

DPA and tryptophan product options

I recommend Lidtke EndorphiGen (which is DPA) and Lidtke Tryptophan 500mg. You can purchase these from my online store (Fullscript – only available to US customers – use this link to set up an account).

If you’re not in the US, these products are available via iherb: Doctor’s Best D-Phenylalanine (or DPA) and Life Extension Tryptophan 500mg (use this link to save 5%).

Additional resources when you are new to using amino acids as supplements

As always, I use the symptoms questionnaire to figure out if low endorphins or low serotonin or other neurotransmitter imbalances may be an issue.

If, after reading this blog and my book, you don’t feel comfortable figuring things out on your own (i.e. doing the symptoms questionnaire and respective amino acids trials), if you need serotonin support, the Serotonin QuickStart Program is a good place to start. This is a paid online/virtual group program where you get my guidance on using tryptophan and 5-HTP safely, and community support during 5 LIVE Q&A calls. You can sign up to be notified when the next live launch of this program is happening. We take a deep dive into product options including Lidtke products and others if you’re not able to access Lidtke.

Low GABA can also affect sleep and cause stress eating. If you also have low GABA symptoms, the next step to get help is the GABA QuickStart Program. This is also a paid online/virtual group program where you get my guidance and community support. Another option is the budget-friendly GABA QuickStart Homestudy program.

Wrapping up and your feedback

I’m thrilled Amanda is seeing these benefits with DPA, tryptophan and GABA and is fine-tuning her results even further. I appreciate her asking her questions on the blog so I can share and we all can learn.

Now I’d love to hear from you – does any of this resonate with you? If yes, which combination has worked best for you for emotional eating and sleep issues?

Is 5-HTP or tryptophan better for you and is vitamin B6 part of your supplement list.

If you’re a practitioner have you seen this combination work well with clients/patients?

Feel free to share and ask your questions below.

GABA Calm and 5-HTP twice a day, after struggling with ADD-like symptoms, have made our day-to-day life so much better!

June 14, 2024 By Trudy Scott 16 Comments

Kimberly is a mom in the community and shared this wonderful feedback about her 8-year old son who is using just two amino acids:

I started my son on Gaba Calm and Serotrex (5-htp) twice a day after struggling with ADD-like symptoms for about 9 months. I’m not sure if he really has ADD or if his gut problems are to blame, but the amino acids have made our day-to-day life so much better!

I think we may need to do some work with his nervous system and on helping him learn to regulate his emotions, but he’s much less mouthy and argumentative than he was before. We still have hard days, but the supplements have helped pull me out of being exhausted and discouraged all the time from fighting with him constantly over everything.

I never get tired of hearing feedback like this and it’s not uncommon for young children (and adults) to see benefits like this very quickly.

She doesn’t know if he has ADD (attention deficit disorder) but she used the amino acids based on his symptoms (low GABA and low serotonin). We know it was the right choice because of his results. Could his symptoms improve even further? Absolutely! We typically increase one amino acid at a time watching for further improvement and stop when we reach the ideal dose.

Because she says “we still have hard days” I’d want to see her increase the GABA and 5-HTP (as mentioned above) and also consider a trial of DPA/d-phenylalanine (for low endorphin emotional symptoms) and possibly tyrosine (for low dopamine focus and attention issues). Low blood sugar can also cause an emotional rollercoaster and eating for blood sugar stability and glutamine helps so much.

When I hear “mouthy” and “argumentative” I immediately consider low serotonin but low blood sugar comes to mind too.

These additional amino acid trials would also be done one at a time with careful tracking of symptoms and adjustments up and down as needed.

If you’re not familiar with the symptoms of low serotonin, low GABA, low endorphins, low dopamine and low blood sugar you can see them all here.

Kimberly acknowledges that they may need to do work in other areas too – like learning to regulate his emotions and addressing gut issues. This is good as it’s seldom just one approach that is going to shift things.

Kimberly has also seen benefits with 5-HTP

I also love this feedback from Kimberly because she is less exhausted and no longer discouraged because her son is doing so much better.

By the way, this mom also experiences benefits from amino acids. 5-HTP helps her with sugar cravings. I shared her feedback in a blog post last year: Would using 5-HTP or tryptophan help when you crave sugar (as a sort of antidepressant) late afternoon/evening?

I was taking a break from tryptophan/5-HTP and realized after reading this post that that might be a mistake! So I added 5-HTP back in mid-afternoon and my sugar cravings are almost completely gone.

And 5-HTP also helped her late afternoon sadness and despair:

I took a 50 mg 5-HTP along with my mid-afternoon Endorphigen capsule, and within just a few minutes I felt the sadness and despair that I often feel in the late afternoon, start to lift. I was astonished at how quickly it worked!

I just love it when the amino acids work for mom and then mom helps her child.

It goes without saying that dietary changes are foundational in situations like this – often for the entire family. This means eating real whole foods, quality animal protein (especially at breakfast to help with blood sugar stability), organic veggies and fruit, fermented foods, healthy fats and no sugar/gluten/caffeine (all covered in detail in my book).

Assessing for and addressing nutritional deficiencies (like low zinc, low vitamin B6, low omega-3s, low iron etc.), removing toxins, addressing the gut (more on this below) and addressing infections are all important too. It’s always a comprehensive approach. But the good news is that you start to get results right away with amino acid supplementation, while you are figuring out everything else.

Gut issues and 5-HTP/serotonin and GABA

As mentioned above Kimberly also suspects possible gut problems with her son. These could include dysbiosis (microbiome imbalance), food sensitivities, leaky gut, parasites, candida and or digestive enzyme issues etc. These always need to be investigated and addressed – because they can all contribute to low GABA and low serotonin – but until the issues are resolved, you can start to see some symptom resolution with the amino acids.

The amino acids he is taking offer an added gut benefit too. In an animal study, Effects of Serotonin and Slow-Release 5-Hydroxytryptophan on Gastrointestinal Motility in a Mouse Model of Depression, 5-HTP was shown to normalize gut motility and growth of the enteric epithelium. The paper concludes that slow release 5-HTP “might be used to treat patients with intestinal dysfunction associated with low levels of serotonin.”

Interestingly, an in-vitro (test-tube) study found that: “Serotonin showed antifungal activity towards all isolates of candida.” This was for certain strains, such as albicans, glabrata, tropicalis, and a few others).

This review article published earlier this year, Gamma-aminobutyric acid as a potential postbiotic mediator in the gut-brain axis discusses the role GABA plays in “psychological disorders, including anxiety, depression, and stress” and also attention deficit hyperactivity disorder. The authors also share that GABA has an impact on “gut microbiota composition” and confirms what has been reported in other research and what we see clinically: the “possibility that GABA may be a potent mediator of the gut-brain axis.”

Additional resources when you are new to using amino acids as supplements

As always, I use the symptoms questionnaire to figure out if low GABA or low serotonin or other neurotransmitter imbalances may be an issue.

Low GABA can cause physical tension and overwhelm, affect sleep and cause stress eating. If you also have low GABA symptoms, the next step to get help is the GABA QuickStart Program. This is also a paid online/virtual group program where you get my guidance and community support. Another option is the budget-friendly GABA QuickStart Homestudy Program.

Wrapping up and your feedback

I’m thrilled Kimberly saw these benefits with 5-HTP and then helped her son with 5-HTP and GABA. I asked if I could share here to inspire other moms and give them hope and she said yes. I do always appreciate feedback from the community and being able to share it on the blog.

Now I’d love to hear from you – Does any of this resonate with you? If yes, which amino acid has helped you and your child and how has it helped?

If you’re a practitioner have you seen GABA and 5-HTP help in situations like this?

Collagen causes anxiety and sleep problems for some people. I would never have connected the dots but apparently I am one of those people.

March 1, 2024 By Trudy Scott 14 Comments

Thank you for solving my sleeping problem! I would never have connected the dots regarding collagen causing anxiety and sleep problems for some people, but apparently I am one of those people.

Although I would fall asleep instantly at bedtime, I would wake up 3 or 4 hours later and while my body was tired, my mind was wide awake and I was unable to go back to sleep for at least 2 or 3 hours. I would think about all the things I needed to do and the challenges I was having. These things would not bother me as much in the day. No matter what I tried – like praying and listening to calming music, I could not shut off my anxious thoughts.

Then it occurred to me that when I go out of town to visit my family, I sleep better. After hearing Trudy’s collagen presentation on the Osteoporosis Summit, I connected the dots! For the last 6 months, I have been putting about 10 grams of Vital Protein collagen in my coffee each morning. I don’t take the collagen with me when I travel. So I stopped using it and lo and behold, I am sleeping the best sleep I have slept in a long time! I even look forward to going to sleep.

So I thank you Trudy from the bottom of my heart for enlightening me. And Margie, I thank you for the wonderful Summit you put together with so much great information. I would still be sleep deprived if it wasn’t for you both!

I was so pleased to receive this lovely thank you email from Merrilyn (sent to me and summit host Margie Bissinger) and said how happy I am for her. I asked if I could share her feedback as a new blog so we can enlighten others who may have similar issues and because it’s an opportunity to share some of sleep/collagen research that supports a possible mechanism. She kindly said yes and answered my questions:

How long had you been using collagen and how long after starting it did the sleep issues start?
And how quickly after stopping the collagen did your sleep improve?
Did you consider using tryptophan or 5-HTP so you could continue to use the collagen? And are you prone to low serotonin?

Read on for some background on the serotonin-lowering effects for some folks who consume collagen, Merrilyn’s responses to my questions, my insights, some of the research, and the tryptophan and 5-HTP products I recommend.

The original collagen/gelatin serotonin-lowering blog/research from 2017

I first addressed this potential cause for anxiety, mood and sleep issues in a blog in 2017 – Collagen and gelatin lower serotonin: does this increase your anxiety and depression?

Margie invited me to share this information and some of the research with those who are using it or planning to use it for osteoporosis. I’m so glad I accepted because clearly there are still folks who are not aware of the potential serotonin-lowering effects of collagen. And I’m sharing Merrilyn’s results via this new blog in case it’s also new to you.

Briefly, collagen and gelatin are used in tryptophan-depletion studies to lower serotonin levels. It does this because neither collagen or gelatin contain tryptophan. Some people seem to be adversely impacted by acute tryptophan depletion/ATD caused by collagen or gelatin consumption while others are not.

If this is all new to you, I encourage you to read the original blog and search for “collagen” to find other information on this topic on my site.

How long had you been using collagen and how long after starting it did the sleep issues start?

I asked how long she’d been using collagen and how long after starting it did she notice problems with her sleep. This wasn’t clear to her and many folks like Marrilyn unfortunately don’t connect the dots right away.

I started Vital Proteins collagen on July 1, 2023. I did mark that down because as I add supplements to my diet, I try to make notes and only do one at a time in case they cause a problem. I did note that I was not consistent with taking it daily and I was only taking 5 to 10 grams daily ( in my cup of coffee!).

I have always had a bit of a problem with waking up at night, but normally go right back to sleep. I can’t remember exactly when the sleeping problems worsened and I never connected them to collagen.

Seems like over time, the sleeping and waking up with ruminating thoughts was getting worse. I had started trying Tylenol PM or Advil PM, only taking 1/2 of one with one plain Tylenol or Advil to help me sleep and relieve any muscle tension from exercise. That did not always help. Taking a whole PM was better, but I felt groggy the next day. I don’t need any now that I have stopped the collagen.

How quickly after stopping the collagen did your sleep improve?

When the cause of waking in the night is due to low serotonin, it’s common to notice improvements very quickly after stopping collagen. This was the case with Merrilyn:

I would say my sleep improved immediately after stopping it. I realized that on the days I was out of town and didn’t take the collagen, I slept better. … but I attributed it to the fact that it is cooler there and my 6 year old grandson wears me out by the evening. I do not take the collagen with me and I had not connected this to the sleep pattern.

I returned home after one trip and started the collagen that next morning and the sleepless nights started again. I can’t remember when I listened to your talk, but I am guessing around January 18th, because I noted that I stopped after that day and according to my Fitbit and my memory, I slept great the night of January 19th and other than one night, I have slept well since.

I do want to commend Merrilyn for keeping a log of new supplements and sleep patterns. It’s something I recommend for all my clients.

Did you consider using tryptophan or 5-HTP so you could continue to use the collagen and are you prone to low serotonin?

I also asked if she considered using tryptophan or 5-HTP (some folks do better on one vs the other) so she could continue to use the collagen – she had not considered this. And I wanted to know if she has been prone to low serotonin or suspects low serotonin currently.

I do believe I am prone to low serotonin based on the little I have read in your book. I have thought about using tryptophan with the collagen and might later. For now, I just want to enjoy sleeping and focus on improving my diet.

I also have evenings when I crave sugar. I can do without it during the day, but evenings are worse. Something else to work on.

She’s referring to the low serotonin symptoms questionnaire in the amino acid chapter of my book, The Antianxiety Food Solution. It’s also on the blog here.

A big clue is the insomnia and anxiety caused by consumption of collagen, and also the evening cravings. There are cravings with all the neurotransmitter imbalances, with afternoon/evening cravings common with low serotonin.

It is possible Merrilyn’s anxiety and insomnia effects are for reasons other than low serotonin: glutamate, oxalate, arginine or a histamine reaction are all possible with collagen intake). Doing a trial of tryptophan or 5-HTP while consuming collagen would confirm a serotonin connection.

Osteoporosis, allergies, serotonin and coffee

Merrilyn also shared that she is in her early 70s and besides osteoporosis and allergies, is generally healthy and takes no prescription drugs. Interestingly, research finds there may be a role for 5-HTP (and presumably tryptophan) for allergies and asthma, so this may be another clue for her.

Of course, reducing her cravings – tryptophan and/or 5-HTP make it easy – will also improve her nutrient status of zinc, magnesium, iron, vitamin B6 and other B vitamins etc. all of which are key when it comes to osteoporosis.

Quitting coffee altogether will likely prevent any waking in the night – yes, even just one cup a day can make a difference – and also help improve the status of many of these nutrients. This is often the least favorite change my clients make but Merrilyn will read about all this in the caffeine chapter in my book and may find tyrosine helps her do so.

Research: Daytime tryptophan depletion altered night-time sleep

A paper published in 2002, Mid-morning tryptophan depletion delays REM sleep onset in healthy subjects, reports the following:

Rapid daytime tryptophan depletion in healthy volunteers significantly decreased plasma tryptophan levels during the day and the evening, followed by alterations in the characteristics of night-time sleep, including increased sleep fragmentation, REM sleep latency, and REM density during first sleep episode.

In this randomized double-blind cross-over study, participants received “a tryptophan-free mixture of amino acids at 10:30 am…. resulting in a 77% decrease and 41% decrease of serum tryptophan at 3:30 pm. and 9:30 pm.” Keep in mind that collagen is a blend of certain amino acids and is tryptophan-free.

The authors discuss the fact that serotonin is involved in sleep regulation but interestingly the mood of study participants was not affected.

Even more interesting is another study that found collagen used before bedtime improved sleep and cognitive function in physically active males. It’s possible it’s doing this because it is lowering serotonin that is too high.

Tryptophan and 5-HTP product options

Products I recommend include Lidtke 500 mg Tryptophan, and Pure Encapsulations 50 mg 5-HTP. You can purchase these from my online store (Fullscript – only available to US customers – use this link to set up an account).

If you’re not in the US, Doctor’s Best L-Tryptophan 500mg and Source Naturals 50 mg 5-HTP are products I recommend on iherb (use this link to save 5%).

Additional resources when you are new to using tryptophan or 5-HTP and other amino acids as supplements

We use the symptoms questionnaire to figure out if low serotonin or other neurotransmitter imbalances may be an issue for you.

Have you made the connection between your collagen consumption and anxiety/insomnia (or other low serotonin symptoms)?

Did you end up simply stopping collagen or have you successfully used it with tryptophan or 5-HTP?

If you’re a practitioner do you see this with your clients/patients who are prone to low serotonin?

And please let me know if it’s helpful that I’m now including product recommendations and where to get them?

Feel free to share and ask your questions below.

Tryptophan 3x/day: OCD and ruminating thoughts are no longer ruling my grandson’s life and he has the most beautiful serene smile

December 15, 2023 By Trudy Scott 34 Comments

I recently received this wonderful feedback from a grandmother who is so happy about tryptophan helping her 17-year old grandson. He had been struggling with OCD (obsessive compulsive disorder) and ruminating thoughts for years:

We started with Lidtke L-Tryptophan Chewables. I was thrilled beyond my greatest hopes to see that it helped immediately! So, we went forward with having him chew a tryptophan when the thoughts started taking hold. This helped for a while, but the thoughts would return.

Finally I read one mother on your blog who gave her son tryptophan 3x/day. So we tried this. That was the magic bullet for my grandson. Getting the tryptophan in before the thoughts could take hold made the difference. And so we have stuck with this plan and have been so happy to see that OCD is no longer ruling my grandson’s life.

Last week I heard the most beautiful words I could imagine. “Hey grandma! The OCD is permanently gone!” Truly a miracle! That’s how it feels to him. As long as we continue to take the tryptophan 3x/day, there is no sign of OCD or ruminating thoughts!

We keep GABA Calm on hand as well and if a bothersome thought enters his mind, he chews a GABA and we don’t hear any more about it.

I honestly don’t even know how to tell you what a blessing your information has been to my grandson. He has the most beautiful, serene smile almost all the time now.

In all my reading and searching for all these years, you’re the only one I saw talking about this. Thank you, from the bottom of my heart, for guiding us to giving this kid his life back. I pray that all the good things you have done to help people come back to you tenfold, Trudy. You are a Godsend.

How much tryptophan helped him and why using it 3 x a day was key

The amino acid tryptophan, used as a supplement, supports low serotonin levels which can cause the worry type of anxiety, ruminating thoughts and OCD (behaviors and thoughts). You can see all the low serotonin symptoms here.

Each of the Lidtke L-Tryptophan Chewables provides 100 mg tryptophan which is often a great starting dose for children and teens. Because it’s chewable and tastes sweet it’s also a great format for children and teens (and “pixie dust” adults who need a very small amount). The bad aspect is that it does contain sugar and is quite sweet. Because you are continually consuming something sweet you may end up over-consuming them if sugar addiction is your issue.

As you can see 100 mg tryptophan did provide some relief in the moment but using the amino acids consistently throughout the day is what I always recommend for best results. In this instance 100 mg tryptophan 3x day worked perfectly for this young man.

Keep in mind there is no one-size fits all for dosing and 100 mg tryptophan x3 per day is considered quite low with many individuals needing 500-1000 mg tryptophan two or three times a day. Also some individuals do better on 5-HTP so this should always be considered too (10 mg 5-HTP is equivalent to 100 mg tryptophan).

Precaution about serotonin syndrome with tryptophan/5-HTP

There are precautions when using certain amino acids and I always review them with all my clients. If they have been prescribed an SSRI, I have them discuss the use of tryptophan/5-HTP with their prescribing doctor so they can be monitored for serotonin syndrome. With careful monitoring and doctor approval I feel comfortable having my clients use tryptophan/5-HTP 6 hours away from their one and only SSRI.

If they are using more than one SSRI and/or a combination of psychiatric medications, the use of tryptophan/5-HTP is not advised.

None of the above applied in this situation but it’s important to be aware of.

How GABA also helps and my recommendation about consistent use too

The amino acid GABA, used as a supplement, supports low GABA levels which can cause physical anxiety and tension, and also an inability to stop intrusive thoughts. You can see all the low GABA symptoms here.

Each GABA Calm provides 125 mg GABA and he uses it as needed: “We keep GABA Calm on hand as well and if a bothersome thought enters his mind, he chews a GABA.”

My recommendation is to assess for low GABA symptoms and consider using GABA consistently throughout the day, typically 2-4 x day.

OCD research: glutamatergic and serotonergic pathway dysregulation

This 2011 paper, Nutraceuticals in the treatment of obsessive compulsive disorder (OCD): a review of mechanistic and clinical evidence, states the following:

Current preclinical research investigating nutraceuticals (natural products) for OCD, reveals encouraging novel activity in modulating key pathways suggested to be involved in the pathogenesis of OCD (glutamatergic and serotonergic pathway dysregulation).

With glutamatergic pathway dysregulation, we would expect GABA to help; and with serotonergic pathway dysregulation, we would expect tryptophan (or 5-HTP to help), as this young man found.

However there are no studies that have used tryptophan for OCD and the above paper concludes that “the serotonin precursor tryptophan is unlikely to be of use in treating OCD while 5-HTP may possibly be a more effective precursor strategy.” The authors state this about 5-HTP because it has been used with success for OCD in conjunction with medication (read the study here).

This lack of research on tryptophan for OCD is one of the reasons I feel compelled to share wonderful success stories like this. And until we have tryptophan research, we must use what we see works clinically and recognize that tryptophan and 5-HTP work in very similar ways.

Other nutrients when tryptophan or 5-HTP or GABA doesn’t help

The above paper does mention other nutrients that are tentatively supported by research and which modulate these pathways: N-acetylcysteine (NAC), myo-inositol, glycine, and milk thistle.

These nutrients could be considered when tryptophan or 5-HTP or GABA doesn’t help or doesn’t help enough. I’ve had much success with myo-inositol for OCD and have always used it in conjunction with tryptophan or 5-HTP. We start with tryptophan or 5-HTP and find a good base line and then add inositol, starting with 500 mg and working up to 18 g/day (as reported in the research).

As you can see, in one study, NAC was shown to be helpful for trichotillomania, a behavioral disorder characterized by the recurring or obsessive habit of pulling one’s hair, resulting in secondary alopecia. I blogged about this here.

They tried many approaches and it took 3 years before they used the amino acids

Patricia, the grandmother, also shared what other approaches they had tried from the age of 14-17 years before seeing success with tryptophan and GABA: therapy, tapping, breathing techniques, acupuncture, yoga and tai chi. None of this helped enough and they rejected pharmaceutical approaches.

It breaks my heart that it took 3 years for her grandson to find relief:

I have been reading your information on OCD for several years (in all my reading and searching for all these years, you’re the only one I saw talking about this) and though I thought it was the best hope I’d heard of for stopping OCD and ruminating thoughts, I was afraid to try the amino acids because I knew so little about them.

So I studied and studied and gained confidence by reading the published reports that seemed to back up what you said about amino acids.

Still, since I was hoping to help my grandson, who was 14 at the time, I was overly cautious. I’m not a medical professional and I’m aware that even really safe and effective treatments can change more than just the issue I was hoping to address.

So, more reading and searching ensued. Meanwhile my grandson’s life was deteriorating. He couldn’t function in many ways because he had no peace. Even sleep was difficult because the thoughts wouldn’t rest – the poor kid had no time at all when his mind wasn’t racing. It broke my heart to see him suffer so much.

Finally, I got the strength to trust my gut and try the amino acids.

I admire Patricia for reading, searching and studying and finally being well-informed enough to help her grandson. And then sharing his story with me so I can share it here with you. She was inspired by one of my other blogs and hopefully you will be inspired and motivated by this wonderful success story.

My hope, with stories like this, is that the amino acids and nutritional approaches are considered first and not after all else has failed.

Additional resources when you are new to using tryptophan, 5-HTP, GABA and the other amino acids as supplements

We use the symptoms questionnaire to figure out if low serotonin or low GABA may be an issue for you.

There is an entire chapter on the amino acids and they are discussed throughout the book in the sections on gut health, gluten, blood sugar control, sugar cravings, anxiety and mood issues.

Have you had success using tryptophan (or 5-HTP) and GABA this way for your OCD and ruminating thoughts or for a loved one? If yes, how much helps?

If you’re a practitioner do you have success using tryptophan (or 5-HTP) and GABA this way with your clients/patients who have OCD and ruminating thoughts?

Feel free to share and ask your questions below.

Would using 5-HTP or tryptophan help when you crave sugar (as a sort of antidepressant) late afternoon/evening?

June 2, 2023 By Trudy Scott 29 Comments

Would using 5-HTP or tryptophan also help when you crave sugar (as a sort of antidepressant) late afternoon/evening? ~ Kimberley

This question was posed in response to my recent blog post about using tryptophan or 5-HTP to help with alcohol cravings/addiction in the late afternoon/evening – to help you wind down and relax, improve mood and sleep, and also as a reward/treat.

I said yes it is often the same cause when it happens late afternoon/evening and when there are other low serotonin symptoms like low mood, anxiety, worry, insomnia etc. When serotonin is low we self-medicate with wine, sugar, carbs, gluten, dairy and chocolate etc. in order to feel good, get a mood boost and reduce stress. 5-HTP or tryptophan stops the sugar cravings, acts as an antidepressant (improving mood) and eases other low serotonin symptoms too.

It turns out Kimberley was craving sugar late afternoon: “it’s definitely late afternoon for me, while I’m making dinner. Maybe it’s time to go back on 5-HTP.”

And then 2 days later she posted how quickly 5-HTP helped when she added it back mid-afternoon:

I was taking a break from tryptophan/5-HTP and realized after reading this post that that might be a mistake! So I added 5-HTP back in mid-afternoon and my sugar cravings are almost completely gone. It’s funny how I forget the symptoms of low neurotransmitters. Thanks for reminding me!

5-HTP works quickly when it’s low serotonin

How wonderful are these results for Kimberley. I never get tired of hearing feedback like this! I appreciate her sharing and giving me permission to share as a blog so you get to learn and be inspired too.

It’s not unusual for 5-HTP to work this quickly and when it does it’s a clue that the symptoms are related to low serotonin and that she found the ideal dose for her needs.

Kimberley had good results with 5-HTP in the past so she went back to what had worked for her before and it worked for her again.

But do keep in mind, some folks do better with 5-HTP and some do better with tryptophan so it’s a matter of doing a trial of each one each.

50 mg 5-HTP: the sadness and despair lifts in a few minutes

A week later she kindly came and shared additional details in the comments of the tryptophan/ 5-HTP alcohol cravings blog, saying:

It’s possible that I was already in the middle of my daily, mid-afternoon chocolate chip binge when I saw your post

I took a 50 mg 5-HTP along with my mid-afternoon Endorphigen capsule, and within just a few minutes I felt the sadness and despair that I often feel in the late afternoon, start to lift. I was astonished at how quickly it worked! I didn’t open the capsule, or chew it, I just swallowed it with water and had a snack afterwards. I really can’t thank you enough for asking that question because I was really struggling with low mood and sadness almost every day.

Even though KImberley had used 5-HTP with success in the past, she was still astonished how quickly it worked and how effective it was. She was also surprised she had forgotten her prior low serotonin symptoms:

Up until January I had taken 5-HTP in the mid-afternoon and then Tryptophan at bedtime, but I wanted to try a program to support my thyroid. That program told me that too much serotonin is often at the root of gut damage, so I weaned myself off of the 5-HTP and tryptophan. I didn’t really notice much difference, except the daily sugar cravings.

I’m not sure how I could so easily forget the symptoms of low serotonin, but I did.

Your question really was a God-send for me, Trudy. It reminded me that there was an option for feeling better (in fact, MUCH better than sugar makes me feel) that didn’t involve something that’s not good for me.

And I really did feel remarkably better the same day, and those results have continued.

Thanks again, Trudy, for continuing to bring these topics up. Some of us are forgetful and need reminding. Usually, when you have symptoms of low serotonin there are enough other issues going on in your life that it’s easy to overlook the obvious. So I’m very grateful that you asked the question, because I feel so much better able to deal with my circumstances now that I’m back on the 5-HTP. Blessings to you!

I am curious about the program that told her too much serotonin is often at the root of gut damage and if they suggested stopping 5-HTP and tryptophan. It doesn’t make any sense to me. I’ll report back when I learn more about this.

More tired during the day and a headache: what to consider

She did mention “I’m finding myself more tired during the day and have also had a headache for the last few days.” I would suspect chocolate/caffeine withdrawal may have caused her headache.

With feeling more tired I’d also watch the dose of 5-HTP. She may find less is better for her needs.

She is also trying tryptophan at bedtime so that may be making her more tired the next day. Doing one amino acid at a time is often the best way to know how each one is affecting you.

Finding what works for your unique needs

Here are some other amino acid/sugar cravings blog posts that illustrate how we all have unique needs and different biochemical imbalances:

The individual amino acids glutamine, GABA, tryptophan (or 5-HTP), DPA and tyrosine are powerful for eliminating sugar cravings, often within 5 minutes

The individual amino acids glutamine, GABA, tryptophan (or 5-HTP), DPA and tyrosine are powerful for eliminating sugar cravings, often within 5 minutes. It seems that this wonderful benefit – over and above the anxiety-reducing and mood-boosting benefits – is often overlooked or poorly understood.

GABA for ending sugar cravings (and anxiety and insomnia)

For Melissa, an unexpected result was that she stopped craving sugar (chocolates, ice cream and truffles) after about a week of taking GABA for her travel anxiety.

It’s a matter of finding what works for your sugar cravings and unique needs. GABA worked for Melissa and yet 5-HTP works for Kimberley – for their sugar cravings.

Here is the tryptophan/5-HTP alcohol cravings blog that started the discussion: Tryptophan had the added benefit of turning me completely off alcohol when I took it to improve mood and sleep during perimenopause. In this case, tryptophan helped Victoria quit the wine that she was self-medicating with in order to feel good and relax.

Resources if you are new to using amino acids as supplements

If you are new to using amino acids as supplements, here is the Amino Acids Mood Questionnaire from The Antianxiety Food Solution (you can see all the symptoms of neurotransmitter imbalances, including low GABA, low serotonin and low endorphins).

There is an entire chapter on the amino acids and they are discussed throughout the book in the sections on gut health, gluten, blood sugar control, sugar cravings, anxiety and mood issues.

Wrapping up

Now I’d love to hear from you ….

Has 5-HTP helped reduce your cravings and/or feelings of despair and sadness? How much helps and how quickly?

Or do you find tryptophan works better for you? If yes, how much helps and how quickly?

What sugary food/s do you self-medicate with in order to feel good?

If you’re a practitioner, do you use this approach with your clients/patients?

Feel free to post your feedback and questions here in the comments.