It’s exciting to see new research confirming the connection between vitamin B6 and dream recall. In this new study, Effects of Vitamin B6 (Pyridoxine) and a B Complex Preparation on Dreaming and Sleep (which was randomized, double-blind and placebo-controlled), 100 participants from across Australia were given 240 mg vitamin B6 (pyridoxine hydrochloride) before bed for five consecutive days. Other study participants were given a B complex. This is the outcome of the study:
- vitamin B6 significantly increased the amount of dream content participants recalled but did not significantly affect dream vividness, bizarreness, or color, nor did it significantly affect other sleep-related variables
- participants in the B complex group showed significantly lower self-rated sleep quality and significantly higher tiredness on waking
Here are my thoughts on these results:
- It’s wonderful to read that Vitamin B6 improves dream recall – this is what I see with my clients all the time.
- With an optimal dose of vitamin B6, I would expect changes in “dream vividness, bizarreness, or color” and this also what I also see with my clients. If they are having horrible/vivid/bizarre dreams, the vitamin B6 changes them to pleasant dreams OR if dreams were not recalled prior to supplementation, they are now remembered and pleasant. The dose of 240 mg was used across the board but based on what we know about biochemical individuality, 240mg may be too much for some folks and not enough for others, so this could have impacted the results.
- It’s not surprising that the B complex taken at bedtime impacted sleep. It’s known to be stimulating and it’s not something I’d advise any client to do. For this reason, I don’t feel it was the ideal control for this study.
The lead researcher is Dr. Denholm Aspy and his primary research focus is lucid dreaming. On his researcher profile on the University of Adelaide website, he describes lucid dreaming and the potential benefits:
In a lucid dream, the dreamer realizes that they are dreaming and can then explore and even control the dream. Lucid dreaming has a wide range of potential benefits and applications such as creative problem solving, treatment for recurrent nightmares and improvement of motor skills through rehearsal in the dream environment (e.g. for elite athletes or people recovering from physical trauma).
He shares that the purpose of his research is to address exploration of the potential applications of lucid dreaming and to “develop reliable ways to induce lucid dreams.” Looking for potential applications of lucid dreaming is very interesting and new to me.
Vitamin B6/dream recall research and pyroluria (a social anxiety condition)
However, this vitamin B6/dream recall research is of particular interest to me because of my work with pyroluria, a social anxiety condition which responds really well to supplementation with zinc, vitamin B6 or P5P (pyridoxal-5-phosphate) or a combination of both, and a few other key nutrients. Here is the pyroluria questionnaire.
One of the classic signs of pyroluria is poor dream recall, stressful or bizarre dreams, or nightmares, signs which the late Carl Pfeiffer, MD attributed to low vitamin B6 status. He suggested that your dreams and dream recall serve as a good indicator of your need for vitamin B6. You should dream every night and you should remember your dreams. They should be pleasant—the kind of dreams where you wake up and want to close your eyes and continue dreaming.
Going back to the above discussion of lucid dreaming, in lucid dreams “the dreamer is aware of dreaming and often able to influence the ongoing dream content.” This is exactly how I would describe my dreams when I have good levels of vitamin B6 and my clients say the same.
Keep in mind that if you do have pyroluria, you may need to increase your dose of vitamin B6 in times of stress. Vitamin B6 can also be depleted by oral contraceptives because they cause both low vitamin B6 and zinc, reduce serotonin levels and increase anxiety. Vitamin B6 can also be depleted by antidepressants, diuretics, and cortisone, so if you start or stop taking any of these, you may need to adjust the amount you supplement.
If this intrigues you and you’re new to pyroluria, I write about dreams and vitamin B6 in the pyroluria chapter of my book, The Antianxiety Food Solution. My blog is also a wealth of information on pyroluria:
- Pyroluria prevalence and associated conditions
- Joint hypermobility / Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome and pyroluria?
- Pyroluria and focal musician’s dystonia or musician’s cramp
- Am I an anxious introvert because of low zinc and vitamin B6? My response to Huffington Post blog
Dream recall and vitamin B6 status is important even if you don’t have pyroluria
Observing your dream recall and hence vitamin B6 status is important even if you don’t have pyroluria. This is because vitamin B6 it has been implicated as a co-factor in more than 140 biochemical reactions in the cell, playing a role making amino acids and neurotransmitters, making fatty acids, and even quenching reactive oxygen species (ROS).
This is partial list showing the importance of vitamin B6 (with both research and clinical evidence) for:
- carpal tunnel syndrome – I’ve had many clients see major improvements to the extent that surgery is able to be cancelled
- PMS (together with magnesium) – all the women I work with see the benefits of vitamin B6 for PMS, perimenopause and menopausal symptoms
- issues with dietary oxalates – vitamin B6 is one of the key nutrients for preventing metabolism of food to oxalate
- morning sickness/vomiting during pregnancy
- protective potential against Alzheimer’s disease due to antioxidant properties
- inflammation and IBD/irritable bowel disease
You may also wonder what the mechanism of action is? How does vitamin B6 impact your dream recall? One hypothesis is that vitamin B6 is a co-factor nutrient used in the conversion of tryptophan to serotonin which is then used to make melatonin. Vitamin B6 is also an antioxidant, is anti-inflammatory, and modulates immunity and gene expression.
If you’re looking for a quality vitamin B6 product, my supplements blog lists a range of vitamin B6 supplements that I use with clients and those in my group program.
Monitoring your dream recall is one very simple way to assess changes in your vitamin B6 status. And we now have new research supporting this. I look forward to follow-on studies by these authors, learning more from them about lucid dreaming and I hope to be able to offer some of my insights from clinical practice.
*** I address some concerns about vitamin B6 toxicity in this blog: Why is vitamin B6 toxic for some and why don’t symptoms resolve when vitamin B6 is stopped? I have yet to see any signs of toxicity in my clients, but I have also not ever recommended more than 500mg/day. However, I was recently made aware (thanks to some folks in my community) that there are some individuals who have issues with very small amounts of vitamin B6. If you have experienced any issues with using vitamin B6 supplementation please share.
What are your dreams like and do you use your dreams to monitor your vitamin B6 status? What improvements have you noticed by addressing low vitamin B6 levels?
If you’re a practitioner do you use dream recall as an indication of vitamin B6 status? Have you seen adverse issues with vitamin B6 supplementation and at what doses?
I’m so thankful I found you. Tryptophan, B6, GABA……they’ve all helped me soooooooo much.
Your advice has helped more than anyone else’s.
And yes, I take 100mg of P5P every night and now I dream, dream, dream. Peaceful, restful sleep. THANK YOU!!!!!
Paula
Thanks for sharing – warms my heart to hear this! Do tell us know how these nutrients have helped you soooooooooooo much? Enjoy those dreams and peaceful sleep!
I am curious if you started with P5P or move to that after trying vitamin B6 with no success? and if you adjust up or down based on stress levels (if you have pyroluria)?
Very interesting that vitamin B6 promoted more dream activity. Supplementation of organic sulfur has also been noted to cause more vivid dreams and dream recall. I don’t know the mechanism, but perhaps it is partly due to sulfur’s propensity to pull out toxic mercury.
Steve
Thanks for sharing – I’d love to know the mechanism too
Some say it may be from getting more intracellular oxygen in the body; sulfur transports oxygen across your cell membranes. The dream activity is nice, but the mental clarity associated with heavy metal detoxification is certainly important. Here’s my experience – http://tiny.cc/sulfur I use MSM marketed for equestrian use; it’s inexpensive and does the job.
Trudy, I appreciate your evidence based approach to health issues, but I think you need to be aware that there are dangers in taking too much synthetic vitamin B6. B6 toxicity is not always reversible. Individuals vary in their response to B6, and while many do well on supplementation, others experience toxicity. I was diagnosed with pyroluria, but experienced serious toxicity.
Vitamin B6 toxicity is a very unrecognized but emerging epidemic that can cause widespread neurological damage to the body. It is not commonly recognized by most of the medical community and is often misdiagnosed. B6 toxicity can cause multiple different symptoms that can vary from person to person. Peripheral neuropathy or nerve damage to the feet, legs or hands is one of the most common symptoms of Vitamin B6 Toxicity. Tingling, shocks/zaps, vibrations, ataxia, burning, numbness of feet, calves and/or hands, and headaches are also commonly reported. Other symptoms are: ocular, sensory, skin, gastrointestinal and psychological.
Hi Ruth
Thanks for sharing about your vitamin B6 toxicity issues – I’m sorry to hear this. I was recently made aware that some folks are having issues with vitamin B6 supplementation and I am planning to address some of this in a follow-up blog (I just updated today’s blog with a note about this). I’m also gathering much of the safety information and the evidence showing that since B6 is water soluble, excesses are excreted via the urine so that toxic levels are never reached.
But we do need to know why some folks have issues and how to reverse them. May I ask some questions? I’m hoping this blog comment and others like this (someone else emailed us about this too) may start to give us clues as to why this is happening. What were your symptoms and how quickly did you notice issues? Have you resolved the symptoms and is yes how? Stopping and/or other nutritional support? I assume it was vitamin B6/pyridoxine you were taking? And how much how often? You mention pyroluria – were you also taking zinc and how much?
There are general questions I’d also ask because as you say it seems like this an emerging issue (unless there is just now more awareness – also a possibility). I would ask what has changed since the 1970s when Dr. Carl Pfeiffer used high doses (there are reports of up to 1000mg twice a day) with no adverse effects? These factors that have wide-reaching adverse effects: history or current use of certain medications like benzodiazepines, gabapentin, BCP, SSRIs, fluroquinolone antibiotics, PPIs, diabetes medications, statins, blood pressure medications etc? even if someone has not used these meds are they exposed via drinking water? our increased EMF exposure (Wifi, cell phones, smart meters)? our increased exposure to GMOs, glyphosate, plastics/phthalates, pesticides etc? interactions with all of the above and certain polymorphisms (we know CYP450 polymorphisms make benzos much more serious in 2/3 of folks)
Sterling Hill also recently wrote about connections between high ferritin, oxalate issues, low vitamin B1 and B2, low zinc, low magnesium and low lysine, and issues with those with a MTRR polymorphism not recycling B12 to B2 (so B12 can be high). I need to dig into the research and interview her as she feels B6 toxicity can be reversed.
I agree that vitamin B6 is synthetic but not that this could be the only cause as there are other synthetic/man-made supplements (such as GABA) that don’t cause issues.
Interesting regarding Sterling Hill, as I have high B12 and MTRR ++. So do you think supplementing with B2 would be even more critical.
Hi Ruth
I really appreciate you sharing this about B6 toxicity in certain susceptible individuals. I’ve written a separate blog post on the topic and quoted you: Why is vitamin B6 toxic for some and why don’t symptoms resolve when vitamin B6 is stopped? https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/why-is-vitamin-b6-toxic-for-some-and-why-dont-symptoms-resolve-when-vitamin-b6-is-stopped/ – so thank you!
It was a challenging post to write simply because there are so many therapeutic benefits of vitamin B6 supplementation and I don’t want to frighten those who do so well, but at the same time we do need to figure out why vitamin B6 is toxic for some. I posed some questions for folks who have been affected in the hope I can learn more about why this may be happening and how we can help those affected.
Also by the way, I did not notice a difference in dream recall with b6 supplementation.
People might think that vitamin b6 is natural, but really it is synthetic and made in a laboratory. If one wants to get more b6, a safer way is to get it through foods.
Wow! The answer to a question I’ve been asking. Where did my dreams go? I also started digging into old labs through Genova and Metametrix. And there it was. Low B6 all over the place. And by finding an easy to understand slide show of what the test results mean, all the pieces started coming together. And of course low GABA. Not one doctor that I ran these tests with ever addressed these things. Just a B multi, mag, NAC and massive doses of L-theanine/Kavinase (phenibut). And all these deficiencies leading to damaged mitochondria. I feel like I’ve had an awakening moment.
A great way to repair and also build new mitochondria is a proposed B vitamin called Pyrroloquinoline Quinone (PQQ). It is the first vitamin discovered since 1948. A calorie restriction diet extends life because less mitochondrial damage occurs. PQQ provides similar beneficial results as calorie restriction.
Here is a podcast about PQQ: http://www.healthquestpodcast.com/064-want-more-energy-try-pqq-my-interview-with-dr-parris-kidd/ and here is an article that says that PQQ provides anti-aging effects due to repair and creation of mitochondria, but when teamed up with CoQ10 and shilajit the benefits are multiplied: http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2013/aug2013_Three-Step-Strategy-to-Reverse-Mitochondrial-Aging_02.htm
Steve, thank you for these links to information on PQQ. I’ve been taking PQQ supplements (Seeking Health brand) because I heard it was good for energy but I didn’t know the science behind it. Now that I know all it can do, I will be sure to keep taking it.
I started taking PPQ after listening to Dave Asprey. I took his unfair advantage PPQ, but expensive and went to Jarrow Ubiquinol with PPQ. Not a supplement that I feel is making a difference, but I think supplementing is a timing thing. I may need to address other issues before adding PPQ.
Jaci
I love awakening moments. It sounds like you found old OAT/organic acid tests – which is one other way to measure B6 levels and confirm what lack of dreams or pleasant dreams are telling us. Elevated levels of xanthurenate in the urine can indicate an insufficiency of vitamin B6, as can elevated levels of kynurenate, especially when xanthurenate is high.
I’m sorry you weren’t educated about the B6 aspect and I’m not surprised phenibut was recommended. I’m sure you’ve heard me say I never reocmmend phenibut (more here https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/gaba-for-anxiety-instead-of-phenibut/)
Keep us posted and be sure to read the pyroluria chapter in my book as there are nuances.
Yes I stopped the Phenibut after your posts. And I did have a slight withdrawal of more agitation. Yes it was an older (2010) OAT test. Maybe I should look into doing it again. And yes, Kynurenate was Very High and Xanthurenate was High.
My sixteen-year-old daughter was diagnosed with “significant social anxiety” a year ago. I found your book a couple of months ago. She answered yes to 23 of the questions on the pyroluria quiz. Since mid-June she has been taking 200 mg of B6 (along with 60mg of zinc and evening primrose.) I see improvement in her behavior – she generally seems happier, and is more willing to participate in activities with the family, and outside of home. She has had vivid, bizarre dreams for as long as she can remember. I asked her if her dreams have changed, she told me “Yes – they are boring!” Instead of being chased by monsters or other such adventures, she dreams of doing ordinary things in ordinary places. I’m not sure if that means she is getting enough B6. She took 300 mg for a couple of weeks, but we took it back down, because she was experiencing some unusual sensations in her arms and feet. It is hard to try to figure out what is working in someone else’s body!
Cathy
Thanks for the feedback and love the dreams descriptions! They should be pleasant and the kind you want to snuggle back into bed to continue dreaming.
Glad to hear about the behavior improvement! Being happier and more “willing to participate in activities with the family, and outside of home” is wonderful for someone her age
With unusual sensations (like tingling) in arms and feet I have clients reduce and/or switch to P5P or use a combo
Wonderful post Trudy, thanks for sharing! B6 has certainly helped me with my anxiety and yes I do notice the dream recall. I’d like to know more about the potential toxicity, I wonder if that is related to genetics? I’m sure Sterling has a lot to say about it, looking forward to learning more.
Carol
Glad to hear it’s helped you with your anxiety and dream recall! May I ask how much helps you and which form – pyridoxine or P5P?
Here is the follow-up post on toxicity https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/why-is-vitamin-b6-toxic-for-some-and-why-dont-symptoms-resolve-when-vitamin-b6-is-stopped/
Are you familiar with Deproloft by Thorne for anxiety. Two Capsules Contain: Vitamin C (as Ascorbic Acid) 250 mg, Vitamin B6 5 mg, Folate 400 mcg, Vitamin B12 550 mcg, Pantothenic Acid 130 mg, Iodine (as Potassium Iodide) 68 mcg, L-Tyrosine 200 mg 5-Hydroxytryptophan 50 mg, Eleuthero extract (root) 50 mg, GABA 50 mg, Rhodiola extract (root) 50 mg. Other Ingredients: Hypromellose (derived from cellulose) capsule, Leucine, Calcium Laurate, Magnesium Citrate, Silicon Dioxide. Do you consider this a safe supplement for anxiety? I didn’t know B6 is synthetic?? Do you know which others in this mix are synthetic? Am I better off taking individual supplements? If so which one should I consider taking first? Thanks!
Slm
I use the trial method with the amino acid questionnaire to determine if someone’s anxiety type – low serotonin, low GABA, low blood sugar. Even low catecholamines can lead to anxiety due to focus issues. Because of this I use individual amino so we can tailor the dose to the person’s need and never use a product that has tyrosine, 5-HTP and GABA in it. These amino acids are also dosed at different times of the day and in a combo product like this it makes it very challenging to dose them at the relevant times.
Thank you for the feedback. Very helpful!
I was directed to take b6 at moderate doses for carpal tunnel many years ago, and though I can’t claim cause and effect, this is when my Interstitial cystitis began. At that time I suddenly became unable to tolerate foods and supplements I had previously taken with no problem, including b6. Now b vitamins cause frequent urination, bladder spasms, and if continues at high doses-bloody urine. I also developed worsening carpal tunnel pain instead of seeing improvement with the b6. I am sensitive to B vitamins now and certainly believe they are not right for everyone.
Amanda
Thanks for sharing and sorry to hear this. I came across this issue when doing some reading for my B6 toxicity blog and will be doing some more digging.
May I ask how much and if it was pyridoxine or P5P?
In the article it mentions the participants taking their B6 at bedtime, but you recommend taking it at lunch or dinner. It seems like taking it at bedtime would not give an individual adequate time for it to breakdown and be utilized during the night to help with dream recall. Does it take awhile for the B6 to start working? If one starts with a single dose of 100mg for a 2 week trial, when do you feel would be the most beneficial time to take it? Thanks for your input!
Lacey
I’ve always had clients use it at breakfast and/or lunch but some people find taking it at dinner time helps them sleep
I have never had bad reaction to P5P. I take it nightly with my L Tryptophan. Maybe the people who take B 6 but not P5P
Sherry
Glad to hear you do fine with P5P – it’s an important nutrient to use with tryptophan. It seems some people have a reaction to B6/pyridoxine and some to P5P
I’ve used B Complex at bedtime for restful sleep off & on for years and started P5P or B6 at bedtime for a month or so off & on couple years ago with mostly good results ( I’ve always had vivid crazy dreams and lots of nightmares- the P5P made the dreams super brightly colored and pleasant in the beginning but turned to stressful endings). This past year since switching to a methylated B complex in am just recently have gotten the feet tingling, etc on the nites of P5P but had not realized why, thinking it was menopause hormone related. A side note I recently discovered a very scary allergy to Niacin (Niacinamide is fine) – throat swelling and huge red flush with hives on right side of body.
Do you have a new article somewhere on the B issues?
Thanks for all your hard work!
Karla
This article covers the B6 toxicity issues some people seem to experience https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/why-is-vitamin-b6-toxic-for-some-and-why-dont-symptoms-resolve-when-vitamin-b6-is-stopped/
Red flush with niacin is common and some folks get hives too – throat swelling is not good and the first time I’ve heard of this reaction!
P5P has been life changing for me and my irrtability in the main. I’m wondering however…when I first started with 50mg at night I did get dream recall straightaway. Then I built up to 100mg p5p over the course of a week and no longer have dream recall? Also, it makes me sleep super heavy and then I’m super groggy in the morning like I can’t quite wake up. Once I get outside into the light and fresh air (it’s January here in the Uk) I wake up properly so I wonder if it’s my melatonin levels? I tried dropping back to 50mg of P5P to ease the grogginess but then the rage came back. I start my zinc orotate soon – maybe that will help with the grogginess? Still though why has my dream recall vanished so soon?!
Hayley
I find some people need to find a good balance of vitamin B6 and P5P. These are also needed to make serotonin and rage and irritability are signs of low serotonin. In this instance we do trials of tryptophan
Hi! I came to this site to research P5P. My health Care provider suggested I add this to my sleep protocol which includes GABA, Tryptophan, theanine and Seriphos. Sleep is getting better, but still it’s a nightly struggle. Can you tell me how long it takes for the P5P to help with dreaming? I haven’t been able to recall dreams for many years.
Julie
My clients notice a shift in dream recall within a week