Dr. Benjamin Lynch, ND Researcher/writer/speaker on MTHFR and methylation defects, was interviewed by host of the Anxiety Summit, Trudy Scott, Food Mood Expert and Nutritionist, author of The Antianxiety Food Solution.
Anxiety: Biochemical and genetic predispositions – COMT, GAD & MAOA
- MTHFR, methylation, SAMe and anxiety (and other health effects)
- Good forms of folate
- How too much folate can raise norepinephrine and cause anxiety
- COMT genetic polymorphisms and anxiety: estrogens, xenoestrogens and sulfur
- MAOA genetic polymorphisms and anxiety: tyramines and histamine
- GAD genetic polymorphisms and anxiety: MSG, glutamates and GABA
- How to test for and interpret these genetic polymorphisms?
- Three top recommendations to reduce anxiety
Here are a few snippets from our interview:
MTHFR helps produce the body’s most active form of folate. So when you eat your uncooked leafy greens or your steamed leafy greens, you are getting ample amounts of methylfolate, which is great. But if you’re eating your dried cereal, your energy bars, your energy drinks or taking your prenatal vitamins and you think you’re doing a great thing and all of these things have this synthetic folic acid, then that is a big problem, because folic acid is absolutely synthetic and that folic acid has to be transformed into the most active form of folate, which is methylfolate because that’s what your body uses. It doesn’t use folic acid. You think folic acid is actually useful for things like neural tube defects, but it’s not; it actually has to be transformed. And so MTHFR contributes the last most important step for that to happen.
Methylfolate, along with vitamin B12, and the protein that you eat help make one of the most important compounds called SAMe. So when you eat your protein and your methylfolate levels are adequate, then you are able to make your neurotransmitters. And if you are unable to make neurotransmitters or eliminate them, you’re going to have symptoms of anxiety, depression, bipolar disorders, schizophrenic episodes, manic episodes, and so on.
The GAD enzyme helps get rid of glutamate and turns that into our docile calming GABA neurotransmitter. It needs magnesium and vitamin B6 to function.
One gene that’s very common in the population that’s also kind of messed up is COMT. COMT is a gene which does multiple, multiple things, but one of which is helps break down dopamine. The other one, it helps break down estrogen.
Another one for anxiety is MAOA, so that’s monoamine oxidase. Histamine is very related to anxiety, and that’s tied in because of the MAOA enzyme, so reducing your histamine-containing foods is a big one.
We mentioned that we’d share some links to MTHFR blog posts on Dr. Lynch’s site. Here is one – MTHFR A1298C Mutation: Some Information on A1298C MTHFR Mutations and MTHFR C677T Mutation: Basic Protocol
We didn’t mention specific studies during the interview but here are a few:
- Are there depression and anxiety genetic markers and mutations? A systematic review.
- Association of a MAOA gene variant with generalized anxiety disorder, but not with panic disorder or major depression.
Dr. Lynch discussed the 23andme genetic testing and said this:
Genetic testing should be an empowering thing for you. You know it’s access to knowledge that can really be beneficial to you, if it’s utilized properly.
Here are links for 23andme (my affiliate link) for doing the genetic testing, and Geneticgenie.com and MTHFRsupport.com for getting the reports.
Here is information about Dr Lynch’s part 1 and part 2 practitioner training (which is very heavily referenced): Methylation & Clinical Nutrigenomics
Dr. Lynch has a free download: folate video presentation along with a pathway planner
If you are not already registered for the Anxiety Summit you can get live access to the speakers of the day here www.theAnxietySummit.com
Very good talk. I have been following Dr. Lynch’s work for two years now and I learned a few things in this talk. I suspect now some GAD gene issues based on the fact that magnesium and b6 supplementation has absolutely turned my life around. I take Jigsaw though, not mg glycinate or mg taurate.
My doctor is an osteopath, naturopath and psychologist. He wants me to do this neurotransmitter protocol from chk nutrition and it is very expensive. Too expensive for me actually. http://www.chknutrition.com/
I mentioned to him that I suspect MTHFR polymorphisms based on my symptoms and he blew it off and said the neurotransmitter problem is underlying all my issues from UC to anxiety to depression etc. I also mentioned that I suspect pyroluria. We did an HTMA that uncovered adrenal exhaustion and aluminum toxicity.
What do you think of these neurotransmitter/amino acid protocols?
Hi Linda –
The only neurotransmitter testing I prefer are the urinary organic acids – where they look at levels of VMA, HVA and 5-HIAA along with quinolinic acid and kyurenine levels.
Adrenals are extremely important to support – which is why I commonly recommend Adrenal Cortex and adaptogens – such as Optimal Adrenal. Electrolytes are also critical as stress depletes K and reabsorbs Na which increases issues. I designed Optimal Electrolyte to support this.
Also checking RBC Essential Elements and Toxic Elements from Doctors Data and their CDSA is very useful along with RBC Fatty acids. Most people seem deficient in GLA.
Best
Dr Lynch
Hi Linda
I also find vitamin B6 and magnesium to be invaluable for many of my clients.
Like Dr Lynch, I find urinary organic acids to be useful. I do not find much value in urinary neurotransmitter testing as it’s too inconsistent. I blogged about it here https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/urinary-neurotransmitter-testing-falls-short/
Most of the time I use the amino acid questionnaire and trials of individual amino acids.
Agreed…the adrenals are extremely important and find many people are low in GLA (especially those with pyroluria (https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/pyroluria-questionnaire-from-the-antianxiety-food-solution/)
Trudy
Also wondering if night time paranoia is indicative of anything specifically I could read about.
Too many causes. Consider Tapping. http://amzn.to/113w6z6 (affiliate link to help support my research)
Hi Linda
I’d also look into low serotonin especially if the other low serotonin symptoms are present (insomnia, worry, anxiety, ruminating thoughts, afternoon/evening cravings, depression, PMS, irritability etc)
Trudy
Hi Linda,
Recent studies have linked paranoia and schizophrenic symptoms to histamine. Psychologists in Finland have begun treating patients with antihistamines and seeing the same results as treatment with antipsychotics. I myself suffered paranoia and hallucinations – it’s not uncommon in the histamine intolerance/mast cell activation community.
This links to Trudy’s comment on serotonin – histamine is a neurotransmitter which interacts with serotonin and others.
You’ll find all the research on my blog.
Yasmina
Thanks for adding to the discussion Yasmina. It’s so important that we look for all possible root causes and histamine intolerance is one of them.
Feel free to come back and share a few relevant blog links here. I’d also love to feature you in a guest blog post and interview you on a future Anxiety Summit!
And yes – big serotonin-histamine connection. Interestingly in the 1960s, diphenhydramine (an anti-histamine we know as Benedryl) was found to inhibit reuptake of the neurotransmitter serotonin. This discovery led to a search for viable antidepressants with similar structures and fewer side effects, culminating in the invention of fluoxetine (Prozac), a selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor (SSRI).
Trudy
Hi Yasmina,
I am familiar with your website because I was doing GAPS protocol in 2012 to try to heal from IBD and had some negative responses to the bone broth. Some others led me to your work. Thanks very much for the connection to my symptoms, I hadn’t thought of that. It would make sense based on my limited understanding of histamine being like a bucket that gets full… why my symptoms would be worse at night. I will investigate further. I have been getting a buzzing feeling in my toes and fingers which I thought perhaps was from emf sensitivity.
Thanks again.
Linda
Thank you Trudy and Dr. Lynch. I’m so grateful to have learned a few more critical pieces to my puzzle, MTHFR being one of them.
I have one question for Dr. Lynch: Is there a resource that you can recommended that could provide comprehensive information on the CBS upregulations as you do for MTHFR?
Thank you so much!
Hi Sandra –
I have quite a bit on CBS upregulations here – in this online course:
http://seekinghealth.org/product/methylation-and-clinical-nutrigenomics-part-i-video-course/
I also have some new material that I need to put together into a video. It is on the ‘to do’ list as I know it is very important to discuss. However, the above course is very good and has a lot on sulfation and CBS.
You’re so welcome Sandra – it was a pleasure to be able to bring Dr Lynch to this summit.
I attended the live training of the course Dr Lynch mentions above and it was very comprehensive
Trudy
Hi, Another great interview thanks. Could you please give more information on the ADH? (not sure what this is) and Co Q10 for non morning people. Doses, products that are available etc. Many thanks, keep up the good work. Regards, Ian
Hi Ian –
Took me a second to understand your question.
NADH + CoQ10:
http://www.seekinghealth.com/nadh-coq10-30-lozenges-seeking-health.html
I suggest:
– Having it bedside
– Upon waking up tired, while still in bed, open the bottle and take out a lozenge.
– Place it under your tongue. Start with 1/2 lozenge. You can just bite it.
– Stay warm under your blankets and be comfortable.
– Within 5 to 10 minutes, you should feel a clarity in your head and a desire to get up.
– If you don’t feel this, take the other 1/2 a lozenge and place it under your tongue.
That should make your mornings way more pleasant.
To support it even further, it requires adrenal and further mitochondrial support.
– Adrenal Cortex – 1 capsule with breakfast and 1 capsule around lunch time IF you are tired at lunch. If not, skip it.
– Optimal Electrolyte – mix 1 scoop into a large glass of water. Drink over a period of a few minutes or longer. Can do one to two scoops daily – sometimes I do 3 or so if I am exercising. This formulation is very supportive of many systems – including mitochondria and adrenals.
These should really make your morning way more pleasant – and the rest of your day as well.
This was all new to me and very intriguing….am going to have to check it out too
Hi, great talk, extremely informative. I was just wondering what was the supplement that was mentioned with CoQ10 to be taken 1st thing in the morning?
It is called NADH which is short for nicotinamide adenine dinucleotide.
Aileen –
This is what I was referring to:
NADH + CoQ10:
http://www.seekinghealth.com/nadh-coq10-30-lozenges-seeking-health.html
I suggest:
– Having it bedside
– Upon waking up tired, while still in bed, open the bottle and take out a lozenge.
– Place it under your tongue. Start with 1/2 lozenge. You can just bite it.
– Stay warm under your blankets and be comfortable.
– Within 5 to 10 minutes, you should feel a clarity in your head and a desire to get up.
– If you don’t feel this, take the other 1/2 a lozenge and place it under your tongue.
That should make your mornings way more pleasant.
To support it even further, it requires adrenal and further mitochondrial support.
– Adrenal Cortex – 1 capsule with breakfast and 1 capsule around lunch time IF you are tired at lunch. If not, skip it.
– Optimal Electrolyte – mix 1 scoop into a large glass of water. Drink over a period of a few minutes or longer. Can do one to two scoops daily – sometimes I do 3 or so if I am exercising. This formulation is very supportive of many systems – including mitochondria and adrenals.
These should really make your morning way more pleasant – and the rest of your day as well.
On reflection, two more questions emerged for Dr. Lynch:
1. You said these genetic polymorphisms turn on and off all the time. That would not appear to be the case with chronic illness where they seem stuck on, but I must be wrong about this. Can you tell me where to find out more about this in addition to the book you mentioned and the article on your website?
2. Can you tells us the names of the specific GAD polymorphisms (call letters and numbers)?
Thank you so much!
Sandra –
1) Great point. Yes you are correct. In chronic illness, the genes can be stuck ‘on’ or stuck ‘off’ or just reduced in function by a certain amount.
I don’t recall which book I mentioned – sorry. Maybe:
http://amzn.to/1x0FS1V
and
http://amzn.to/1xyRGHJ
2) I dont have those specific call numbers. But you can export your 23andMe raw data into the MTHFR Support report here and get GAD data:
http://bit.ly/ZXz5cQ
Sandra
I think you may be looking for “The Biology of Belief” by Bruce Lipton
Trudy
Great information. I too am ++ on CBS. I purchased quantified sulphate urine testing strips from Amazon. I took yucca root for a very short time when eating protein. I take 5 methyl folate and b12 hydocobalin and the sulfate strip test went down from 800 to 200 – or 400. I also did the LRA/act/elisa food sensitivity test. Reacted strongest to yellow 5…I never eat that but it was in my lipstick so I was eating it! I also reacted to dairy. Cut the dairy and other things and I feel so much better. No congestion when I eat and funny thing when I when I wake my teeth feel clean. They used to have that “I have to brush my teeth now feeling”. Thanks for your presentations. I listen to them on the treadmill.
Gloria –
Thanks for sharing – and awesome that you feel so much better!
Gloria – we love success stories like yours – thanks for sharing
I am MTHFR 1298 with CBS and found I am low in glutathione. Can one get this with supplements such as NAC, carnitine, a lipolic acid , vit c and using cream with glutathione or clilnical glutathione lozengers to increase it in the body?
Is taking the cream or lozengers safe ..? or worth the $
Stacy –
NAC helps raise glutathione yes. But one also needs glycine and glutamate, B6 and a few other things that escape me. Then the body imports these inside the cell and assembles them into glutathione.
It’s quite a bit of work and for people that are quite ill, I don’t believe it is effective enough. For those that are pretty healthy, I do think NAC is effective at raising glutathione levels.
Glutathione creams – I am not sure if effective or not. I don’t use them clinically. That would be a great question for Dr Quig at Doctors Data – I will ask him.
I use liposomal glutathione – and recommend people start very low and work up.
If they don’t tolerate sulfur – eggs, cruciferous veggies, wine – then I don’t recommend they take NAC or glutathione. Instead, I recommend stopping all sulfur for a bit – few days – along with:
– Thiamine 50 mg daily
– Molybdenum 500 mcg daily – for a week and then stop
Then try adding back in some sulfur or the liposomal glutathione.
If still sensitive, then possibly need more liver support, vitamin E and calcium D Glucarate.
This is what I recommend for raising glutathione:
http://www.seekinghealth.com/liposomal-glutathione-seeking-health.html
Glutathione lozenges – I don’t think those are useful unless it is s-acetyl glutathione.
I had the genetic testing from 23 and me done several months ago. I really appreciate the opportunity to view Dr. Lynch’s talk about MTHFR. I spent most of my afternoon on his site listening to several of the other videos on this complicated subject. Although I am working with a healthcare practitioner who is pretty well versed in epigenetics I really appreciate the chance to learn from so may experts in the field. Its now clear to me that I have to address my gut issues first and the tackle my C677t and CBS C699T second. Thank you Dr. Lynch. r Your generous gift really made a difference in my life, Cat LeVasseur
Cat –
Excellent that it’s been helpful to you.
I would say attacking your gut issues first is correct. Very important.
As you are doing that, the MTHFR and CBS will both start functioning better on their own – bit by bit.
Try Castor oil packs on your abdomen – nightly – that can really make a difference for some people.
Hi,
Dr Lynch, I realize that this talk is about anxiety but I caught something in your explanation that I am very interested in. You were speaking of SNP (single polymorphisms) and genetic mutation; at this point you specifically distinguished between polymorphism and mutation. However you then go on to identify humans as mutants, indicating that there is, indeed, genetic mutation. Can you respond to the difference between polymorphism and the process of mutation? THank you!
Jen –
I will give a little bit of info on this as it is complex.
We evolve – everything evolves – over time. The faster the specie reproduces, the faster it evolves. Look at antibiotic resistance – a classic example of how natural selection works quickly.
This will be helpful:
http://ghr.nlm.nih.gov/handbook/mutationsanddisorders/genemutation
The process of mutation occurs by damage over time to the gene.
This can be done through folate deficiency – leading to increased uracil in our DNA vs thymine – causing DNA breakage. If this continues, the gene will not be able to repair itself and it gets mutated.
Mitochondrial damage which leads to mitochondrial DNA damage and loss of function and a permanent mutation. This can happen from heavy metals, high sugar diet, poor fatty acids, low glutathione, etc
It is a topic I want to study more but that is a basic introduction.
Thank you Dr. Lynch! I have been following you ever since I did the 23 & me analysis and uploaded it to the Genetic Genie which you recommended. My defective snp’s came back heavy in all of the BHMT’s, MAO, CBS, SHMT,MTRR, and VDR, all are homozygous. Even though these are not the exact snp’s that you refer to in the MTHFR condition, they all seem to play into it. I cannot find a physician in Central Florida that knows anything about this. I did see the only one listed on your site and he just wanted to copy all the information that you had sent to me. He has not offered anything to help me. I am physically in trouble, have a great pain in my head, seems to come from naso-pharyngeal nerve. Am developing internal cysts and kidney adenoma. Regular physicians don’t seem to take any of this serious. I am experimenting on myself, following as much of your information as I can, but don’t know what to do next. Can you advise, please?
Carleen –
Sorry to hear about this.
I would not focus on the SNPs in this situation but rather on the overall causes and dysfunction.
I would look for a doctor from:
Holistic-Minded Physician Associations who think outside of the mainstream ‘treat the symptom’ paradigm
American Association of Naturopathic Physicians
Orthomolecular Institute
American Academy of Environmental Medicine
Institute for Functional Medicine
American College for Advancement in Medicine
American Holistic Medical Association
Google those and their links will pop up. Then locate a doctor near you.
Dr. Lynch:
I have two 1298s, COMT, 450 detox issues, etc per 23andMe and MTHFR Support and blood tests. I was recently tested for histamine level (61) and was told I do not have a methylation issue. Do you agree with that test? I do have many chronic health issues, especially problems detoxing.
From the same testing, my husband has two 677s and “worse” genetic issues per a practitioner’s opinion of 23andMe. Of course, we do not know if these genes are “on or off” in a significant way.
Thanks for your opinion.
Lynne –
Histamine has many factors and I do not believe it is a reliable marker for methylation status.
People can have very high histamine due to pathogens in their system, low immune function, high stress, food allergies, etc
I would rather see your hormone panel – from Genova Labs or http://www.precisionhormones.com/
Also ordering the methylation profile from Doctors Data is important – that will show a methylation issue – or not.
http://www.seekinghealth.com/methylation-profile-doctors-data.html
These will show dysfunction – and then need to identify what the causes are.
Love the Anxiety Summit. This is my 2nd time listening and I follow Trudy and Dr. Lynch whenever they speak.
I just started to look into the sulfation pathway I’m glad Dr. Lynch’s covered this. I would like to know more about the Glucuronidation Pathway.
I am homozygous 48yrs, A1298C, have Hashimoto’s, went through infertility and miscarriages. I was having brain fog, yeast, low blood sugar, and terrible mood swings. I went low carb, gluten & casein free, grain free, drank filtered water, and ate tons of leafy greens, completed a 5 week gut healing detox and took many prescribed suppliments including B12 Methylcobalamin and methylfolate with care of my ND. The hot flashes stopped, and hormones returned to normal but the fog, pain, and moods did not get better and my heavy metal test came back high for Copper.
I also suspected an oxalates cause of the type of pain and yeast and my diet then was Paleo-tons of almonds, sweet potatoes, and spinach. I cut back on oxalates and started NAC with Molybdenum and 40mg biotin and the yeast has not returned but the pain, mood, & fog still continued and then I suddenly could not tolerate B12s and Methyl folate, or methyls anymore. I get headaches, stiff neck, insomnia, and a rash on my shoulders. Don’t know if that was from detoxing from Copper. If I add SAMe, I turn into a very rage filled, annoyed, and irritable person with hateful, mean thoughts.
I found Dr. Lynch methylfolate side effects and the niacinimide helped but still get headaches when I try to add Hydroxocobalamin or Adenosylcobalamin. I’ve been laying off B12 for weeks now just trying to work out, sweat, and taking epsom salt baths. I recently took MSM and D-Ribose after an aerobic workout and my muscles locked up with pain and stiffness. My ND said I have a sensitivity to sulfites.
Of course my wonderful healthy diet was high in Sulfur. I was eating lots of cruciferous vegetables and grass fed beef or free range chicken and occasionally drinking coconut water. I stopped taking, NAC, biotin, MSM, and Liposomal Glutathione for now and started Moybdenum, Chlorella, Yucca, NADH + CoQ10 lozenges. Hesitating on Hydroxocobalamin cause 1/2 a lozenge causes those migraine headaches. I know that the B12 should help but can’t endure more added pain. Should I keep trying B12? I’m following the sulfite treatment plan on http://www.heartfixer.com/AMRI-Nutrigenomics.htm and wonder if Dr. Lynch concurs?
Hope this will finally work. Every protocol I follow just seems to make the pain worse.
Open to any helpful insight.
Myra –
I would look at your hormones.
http://www.precisionhormones.com/
All the nutrients you were taking can affect them pretty strongly.
I’d also look at an organic acids test and plasma amino acids test – and RBC Fatty acids.
Another key test is the Methylation Profile by Doctors Data and CDSA for digestive function by Doctors Data.
Do these tests and you’ll have a lot of information to go on – and the need for guessing goes way down.
Hydroxo B12 reduces hydrogen sulfide and nitric oxide. So appears you may have low circulation as if you take that supplement, you get headaches. Seems that you need to increase blood flow. That can occur with arginine IF you’re not too loaded in oxidative stress. If you are, the arginine won’t work. You can try a capsule and see.
Thiamine or Benfotiamine can be helpful as they are typically depleted from sulfites – and they also reduce aldehydes. Be worth trying to see if Thiamine 50 mg helps.
I developed a B vitamin complex without B12/folate – but all the other B’s – called B Minus.
There is also Optimal Start which is a multivitamin without copper, iron, folate, B12, calcium. This may be something to consider as well.
However, the best bet is to stop guessing and get those tests done and interpreted by a skilled doctor.
Dr. Lynch,
Thank you for replying!
I’m going to request the organic acids test and plasma amino acids test – and RBC Fatty acids and I want to get the Methylation Profile from Doctors Data as well.
My hormones were were way off in 2012 and my PC gave me bio-identical hormones (6 mo) but I found a functional health practitioner who took me off of them and gave me Estro factors and all my hormone levels returned to normal and hot flashes stopped but now I’m always cold like I use to be all my life. Hope the flashes don’t come back while I’m off B12.
I took NAC with Molybdenum for months because I had all the symptoms and of Candida you listed on “Methylation Inhibited by Candida-Rant & Raves.” I’m worried that since I stopped NAC and if I have to minimize animal protein and start a low sulfite diet, Candida will come back.
I have your Thiamine, Arginine, B-minus, Molybdenum, D-Ribose, Hydroxocobalamin, Adenosylcobalamin, NADH + CoQ10 lozenges & Liposomal Glutathione.
I think I have oxidative stress cause I didn’t feel better on Arginine. My insomnia got worse after the copper detox.
I just feel an urgency to get back on a B12 and will try anything. I appreciate your advice!
Dr. Lynch,
I think your interview sounds amazing and wish I could have listened to it, but I was busy Wednesday when your email came and by the time I got around to it your interview was no longer available. I really wish you would alert us sooner when you are going to have an interview. All these summits are awesome but there is little money left over to buy them after all the supplements & tests we pay for in trying to get healthy for a family of six. I wish there was a wider window of opportunity to listen for free. Thanks for all you do!
Rhonda –
I hear you. I wanted to send out an email earlier but it’s tough when I am traveling all over the place.
I left to Japan the day this started and was too busy to send anything out prior to leaving.
I sent the email the day of hoping that many would be able to listen then.
I cannot control the duration when things are available for free or not.
I need to get better about sending out emails – I need to have one of my staff do it instead of me. That will solve the problem.
Best
Dr Lynch
Dr. Lynch –
I am fascinated by this discussion.
I suffered several miscarriages and then after testing by a fertility doctor was diagnosed with the double mutation of MTHFR. They gave me a prescription for folate and Lovenox injections daily through my successful pregnancy with my son. I have been unable to hold a pregnancy since.
But the reason I am writing is that I also have general anxiety and have for as long as I can remember. This is the first i am hearing that there could be a connection between MTHFR and anxiety!
In my case what supplements should I be taking to counteract the depletion of folate that the double mutation of MTHFR causes in my body. None of the doctors without being pregnant have recommended the continued use of the folate prescriptions as they probably don’t know about the connection to anxiety.
Thanks for your help!
Hi Morgan –
Please read and listen to the podcast here:
http://mthfr.net/prenatal-supplementation-optimizing-your-future-child/2012/01/20/
This has helped MANY women have successful pregnancies.
I do hope it helps you as well 😉
Best
Dr Lynch
I learn so much from your lectures so thank you! I just found out that I do have the MTHR (one copy of the C variation on position I298). I have been taking folic acid in high doses (5mg per day) for about a month now. I started this prodcut to try to help the symptoms I was having since I do have anxiety and recently some severe depression (feeling out of control). Could this be because of the folic acid? IF so how would I detox the folic acid or have I created a real problem? I am desperate to feel better and frustrated that I think I am making things worse. Thank you!
Coreen –
The MTHFR A1298C variant does not slow the performance down too much for the enzyme- only about 20%; however, that does not mean it is performing well all the time for you.
There are other things which affect MTHFR such as vitamin B2 deficiency (riboflavin) and hypothyroidism (esp low T4).
Folic acid will go out of your system in about 2 months or so – possibly 3. There is no real need to ‘detox’ the folic acid. A coffee enema would be the fastest way to do it or taking bile salts as folates are stored in the liver. It is important to know that other minerals and vitamins are also stored in bile so if you dump bile, you are also dumping nutrients.
The severe depression could be due to many reasons. Things like 5-HTP could really help.
If you taking the 5 mg of folic acid daily started all the depression, then I’d definitely talk with your doctor and get off of it.
Folic acid does have many harmful side effects which affect folate metabolism.
There are many recommendations in the interview which should help your anxiety and hopefully depression as well.
Keep in mind that mood is regulated very much by nutrient levels and enzymatic function – so it can be improved quite readily! 🙂
Best
Dr Lynch
Thank you so much for this great information. I appreciate it alot. I have been listening and reading as much as I can from your site. You are a big help & appreciate the education very much. Have a nice evening!
Coreen
Is there a link to histamine intolerance and methylation.
I have just ordered the DNA testing kit but now believe i might need the organic acids test? My body is completely out of wack due to an adverse reaction to SSRI’S and other psychotropic drugs that i only took for a short time.
Insomnia which i never had until 7 mths ago and acute anxiety are now an everyday battle. Can i reverse this, will the test’s show what i need to do?
Need help! 🙁
Robyn
I’m sorry to hear you are battling. In our interview Dr Lynch talked about how the MAOA polymorphism can cause intolerance for histamine-containing foods. It’s a connection I’m just now learning about so I’ll let him comment further. He did recommend this as a resource http://www.lowhistaminechef.com I’m looking forward to checking it out and learning more.
I would also suggest looking low neurotransmitters and the use of targeted individual amino acids for the anxiety and insomnia https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/anxiety-summit-targeted-individual-amino-acids-eliminating-anxiety-practical-applications/ I use trials of amino acids rather than testing and don’t do urinary neurotransmitter testing.
Of course I’d also address all the other factors than could be factors: real food, protein, sugar and blood sugar, gluten, low zinc, low vitamin B6, caffeine, gut health etc
You don’t mention which SSRIs and psychotropic drugs you took. Paxil is notorious for being problematic and the benzodiazapines (like Ativan, Xanax etc) can cause a whole set of new problems. Check out my interview with Catherine Pittman season 1 (https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/anxiety-summit-benzodiazepines-risks-vs-benefits/) and Dr Prouksy on getting off psych meds (https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/anxiety-summit-tapering-psychiatric-drugs-dont-ruin-life/
Trudy
I have really enjoyed the anxiety summit and have learned so much. My naturopath thinks I may have the MTHFR gene mutation although I have not been tested as my health insurance company will not cover the test. I had an unfortunate incident when I took Macrobid for a urinary tract infection and on day 4 had a neurological reaction which left me with irreversible peripheral neuropathy. The side effects warning label on the macrobid says this can happen when the body is deficient in Vitamin B-12. So that is why my naturopath feels I could have the gene mutation and am not getting the vitamin b-12 I need. I am now on supplemnts like Vitamin B-12/Methyl Folate and P5P but have not had a change. I’m so tired all the time and then neuropathy has no improved. My question is, I want to try some of your supplements but don’t know where to start. I have such low energy, constant fatigue, intense sugar cravings and headaches. I don’t know if I’m absorbing any of these vitamins at this point. I am also taking Alpha Lipoic acid in the hopes it will help the neuropathy but so far nothing. Any insight and advice either of you can give me would be very much appreciated. How do I proceed without knowing if I actually have the mutation. I would be willing to try some supplements to see if I feel better on them. Thanks so much!!!
Hi Trudy,
My Dr said doing extensive gut test is most important; however I want to know what my family is disposed to; ie MTHR? Dr mentioned possibility of getting test through 123andme ; he also has ordered some through smartdna I think they are called. Can you please let me know which place lets you know what snps are presenting themselves/active? (excuse my terminology) if you are aware? I read somewhere does in the USA however I can’t recall where. I don’t think 123 does? Also is it a saliva test? (Note these dna would be coming from Australia.) He said it is better to order through these or similar as they show 10 times more genes tested rather than the 2 for mthr here in Australia. Much appreciated. However I think it would be much better if results show which are presenting themselves..
Cecily
I like 23andme and run raw data thru geneticgenie and other sites
Hello Trudy,
I take extra B6 and zinc for pyroluria (thanks to your great book) and am
currently working to reduce Candida and Oxalates (per the results of an Organic Acids Test).
Do you think it would be helpful for me to be tested for MTHFR MUTATIONs and METHYLATION STATUS (perhaps to uncover some underlying issues and further improve my health)? If so, is there a lab that you can recommend particularly one that can be used directly by the patient and without a doctor’s order? You wrote above in 2015 that you liked 23andme.
Thanks so much!
P.S. Tried the Wm Walsh method with a Walsh trained physician but found the blood tests for copper/zinc/histamine to be unreliable (and quite variable). In your blog, Dr. Ben Lynch wrote that he thought histamine was not reliable to check methylation status as it can vary due to other factors. I believe this was the case with my varying whole blood histamine results which showed over than under methylation.
Elaine
I feel knowing your MTHFR polymorphisms is helpful and I still like 23andme because you get this and more. You do need to use a 3rd party site to run the various reports from the raw data 23andme provides. A colleague will be coming out with a gene test panel later this year and I’ll announce it when it’s ready.
Sorry to hear your Walsh protocols didn’t help. Copper and zinc is challenging to test even when serum copper and plasma zinc is used. I assume these were tested and the ratio was looked at (as Dr. Usman describes here https://www.everywomanover29.com/blog/zinccopper-balance-in-autismpyroluria-dr-usman/)? Are you saying you had whole blood histamine tested and it showed overmethylation one time and then undermethylation another time? I’d love to hear which lab did the testing and how you scored on Joan Matthews-Larson high histamine and low histamine questionnaires?
Glad to hear you have my book and like it!
Dearest Trudy,
1. Thank you so much for your guidance on testing for MTHFR mutations. How great that your colleague will be coming out with a gene test panel.
2. I did a couple of rounds of testing with the Walsh trained physician. The dr never spoke of zinc/copper ratio….I am very grateful to learn from you that ratio is important here.
ON ROUND ONE, my urine kryptopyrrole test was in the 20s (elevated). I had already started on extra zinc and B6 on my own before this pyroluria test….and felt much better (again thanks to your book!). The dr sent me to Labcorp for blood work. Both my plasma zinc and serum copper were in normal range. Doing the math, I can tell you that my zinc to copper ratio calculates to be 1.5. Again, the dr made no mention of ratio just individual levels. He told me I did not have a copper elevation/problem. My whole blood histamine was in the low normal range. The dr told me that per my low normal histamine level, I was leaning toward over methylation and placed me on folic acid. He also placed me on high doses of zinc and B6. **I gave the dr the benefit of the doubt but wondered how I could have pyroluria and normal zinc and why I needed folic acid if my histamine was in normal range.
ON ROUND TWO: my urine kryptopyrrole was in normal range. My bloodwork was: plasma zinc went above normal, serum copper rose but stayed within normal range. Doing the math, my zinc to copper ratio was 1.7. My whole blood histamine went from low normal to very highly elevated putting me in the category of under methylation.
After two rounds, I ended my consultations with the dr.
Just took the J.Matthews- Larson questionnaire and scored 10/18 for low histamine and 3/20 for high histamine.
I score over 15 in your pyroluria questionnaire, feel better with more zinc and B6, use 5HTP and GABA as needed based on your guidelines. I still struggle with episodes of PMS symptoms, some cycles worse than others. I am not sure what to do regarding methylation supplements and wonder if I need additional folic acid and whether I should use folate or methyl folate versus folic acid. Hence, my reason to consider doing MTHFR testing.
Trudy, thanks again for all your guidance and wisdom.
I am so grateful to have this forum to both share and learn!